Conceited Forums Topic: New Styles..

Conceited Forums Topic: New Styles.. http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles We have a very active and passionate community and our forums is the place to get tips and chat with other users about all our products. Join today and meet some great people! Note: if you have a feature to request or a bug to report, make sure you use <a href="http://conceitedsoftware.com/submit-ticket">this contact form</a>. en-US Sun, 14 Mar 2010 15:21:11 +0000 bbpress 1.0-alpha-4 <![CDATA[Search]]> q http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/search.php scowl on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles/page/2#post-439 Sun, 05 Jul 2009 02:50:02 +0000 scowl 439@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ Was just coming here to check and see if any new styles had been released via the forums and saw what was going on in this thread. New user to Linkinus, I've been on IRC since '94, and the Whisper style is the prettiest damn thing I've ever used. The nick alignment is great, I had been using my own mIRC theme that does that for years. This is without a doubt, the best IRC client I've used in 15 years. Now it just needs SILC so I can drop Colloquy. :) Okeanos on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles/page/2#post-303 Mon, 15 Jun 2009 19:57:16 +0000 Okeanos 303@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ The forum issues are known and we'll deal with them in time. Right now, however, our priorities are a little different I have to admit, though. cheef on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles/page/2#post-299 Mon, 15 Jun 2009 17:15:23 +0000 cheef 299@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ 'We people' CAN read, but for us the forum software is temperamental. Upon logging in, I get no option to reply or create a new thread, no box at the bottom of the page to do so. It seems that only after 'time' (whatever 'time' is defined as) all of a sudden upon refreshing the reply boxes at the bottom of the page will appear. Like I say, temperamental, and also quite frustrating when you can't post or reply when you want to, having to wait and best guess when the boxes will re-appear. Patch on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles/page/2#post-298 Mon, 15 Jun 2009 15:27:38 +0000 Patch 298@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ You people can't read, there is NO NEW THREAD BUTTON, the bottom of the page, you just write it up and press the button, it doesn't go to a new page specifically for making a new thread. T'hain Esh Kelch on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles/page/2#post-296 Mon, 15 Jun 2009 15:07:14 +0000 T'hain Esh Kelch 296@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ I don't have a 'New thread' button either... :( Okeanos on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles/page/2#post-294 Mon, 15 Jun 2009 09:44:35 +0000 Okeanos 294@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ The documentation will be extended over time. It just takes a while to get it all compiled. ohkine on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles/page/2#post-289 Mon, 15 Jun 2009 03:15:26 +0000 ohkine 289@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ By the way, i have been trying to edit some of these new styles for about the last 4 hours and i guess i have to give up. I thought i was pretty good with this kind of stuff (in fact i've done Web design and PHP in the past), but without some kind of format specification or something i have absolutely no idea what i'm doing. (And the wiki article doesn't count — it just lists a bunch of random methods and values, it doesn't explain how any of them work or how the files are structured internally or anything.) :/ ohkine on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles/page/2#post-288 Mon, 15 Jun 2009 01:46:42 +0000 ohkine 288@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ <blockquote>@cheef: Linkinus uses System preference Date & Time settings as far as date/time formats are concerned.</blockquote> Does that mean there is no other way to set a time format in Linkinus? If so, that seems like a poor decision to me, because Linkinus obviously can only use one of the system time formats. That means either you're going to annoy people who set the 'short' format to HH:mm as intended but want to have seconds in IRC, or you're going to annoy people who set the 'medium' format to HH:mm:ss as intended but don't want to have seconds in IRC. It's lose-lose. Patch on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles/page/2#post-286 Sun, 14 Jun 2009 15:10:33 +0000 Patch 286@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ @cheef There isn't a button, go to the bottom of the page and there's a new thread box. cheef on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-285 Sun, 14 Jun 2009 07:37:10 +0000 cheef 285@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ nl, I just don't have the option anywhere on the main form page to create a new topic. I just see a set of threads, that's it. Where you say: "Linkinus uses System preference Date & Time settings as far as date/time formats are concerned." ...does this mean I can somehow get seconds to display or not? Sorry to re-ask, but your comment doesn't really answer my question, I'm very new to Linkinus. :-) Appreciate this thread is now going off-topic, so if a new thread can be created that would be great. nl on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-284 Sun, 14 Jun 2009 04:46:32 +0000 nl 284@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ @cheef: Linkinus uses System preference Date & Time settings as far as date/time formats are concerned. What happens when you try to create a thread? cheef on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-277 Fri, 12 Jun 2009 20:03:40 +0000 cheef 277@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ Yep I can't create a thread either. And on that basis.... Can anyone enlighten me as to how I can includes seconds showing on the time stamp on the new version of Linkinus? I currently see "21:00" on the Whisper theme, but I'd like to see "21:00:00"... Soliah on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-276 Fri, 12 Jun 2009 13:07:28 +0000 Soliah 276@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ Well I'm pretty happy with the way it looks for now. I can't seem to be able to put [] around the timestamp without some whitespace appearing after the PM/AM. And I can't make all links appear the grey in the previous sessions history without making all links grey. At first I was trying to use JQuery to add the necessary modifications to the nicknames and timestamps but figured out I could do it in CSS, but like I said before timestamps become [3:00 PM ] :( (And I swear my simple selector JQuery wasn't working). If a mod wants to start a thread where people can contribute it'd be nice. (Seems like I can't make threads on my own?) cheef on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-275 Fri, 12 Jun 2009 12:18:18 +0000 cheef 275@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ Soliah, that's just what I'm after too. Good work. Perhaps worth a thread of its own to discuss improvement options? nl on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-274 Fri, 12 Jun 2009 11:03:16 +0000 nl 274@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ @Soliah: thanks, will download and test it now! nl on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-273 Fri, 12 Jun 2009 11:02:58 +0000 nl 273@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ @alphalpha: there are thousand of developers whose first priority was to make their app look like an IRC client. mIRC, irssi, ircii, xchat and so many others. This has never been, is not and will never be "the top item on Linkinus' TODO list". About the styles however, I didn't mean you guys were "expecting too much". What I meant was more styles will come, people are working on them. I'm not at all surprised to hear that not everyone is happy with the 6 bundled styles. I'm just saying delaying the release so we could bundle some more styles wouldn't have made anybody any happier. Soliah on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-272 Fri, 12 Jun 2009 05:34:46 +0000 Soliah 272@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ <a href="http://www.betsubetsu.net/files/mIRC.lnk2Style.zip" rel="nofollow">http://www.betsubetsu.net/files/mIRC.lnk2Style.zip</a> I made a mIRC look alike. It's no where near as functional as the proper styles but it should get people started. It's definitely far from complete. Patch on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-271 Fri, 12 Jun 2009 05:10:56 +0000 Patch 271@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ @alphalpha I don't really agree with the first part of your post, I think it's organized SO much better than it was before, this is how you truly organize a CSS type of thing, just requires know-how to find stuff, since the SDK is updated yet. But I FULLY agree with your last paragraph and it's basically what i've been trying to say in between my frustration-typing :P alphalpha on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-268 Fri, 12 Jun 2009 00:07:54 +0000 alphalpha 268@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ I think it comes down to this: The old styles were far simpler to tinker with if there was a problem. There was no cryptic JS to go through and the messages were structured very neatly in separate folders and files that made changing one single message an easy task that could be described to someone quickly. The new styles, on the other hand, rely on JS to show the message and are therefore far more difficult for a normal user to edit. Telling someone to edit "Incoming/Action.html" is way simpler than saying "go to the main.js file, search for a switch involving messageDetails and change code there.". The process doesn't simply involve HTML&CSS anymore, but now people must be aware of javascript syntax littered all over the place. In addition, if someone were to create a completely new style from scratch, they would basically be forced to reimplement the entirety of the logic that renders text on the screen. Furthermore, if they made a change to that core behaviour, it would only be available on that style, making it really difficult to share functionality. What happens if/when Linkinus fixes a bug in the way scrolling works, for instance? Or if new emoticons are added. Will every single style need to be updated? Right now that logic is independently stored in every style. I also worry about the fact that the internationalization support that the old style sdk had builtin is now completely thrown out the window by forcing the use of JS for every message. Where you used to get free internationlization by using the Cocoa bundle API, you now have to handle languages manually. I assume this will become an issue very soon. Overall I question the design of the new styles architecture. It's far more limiting than the old one was. Frankly, I played around with it a bit and I could probably make the necessary changes, but I don't think I want to deal with the headache of maintaining it in the future. I'd rather wait until a sane default style is implemented and officially supported that simply shows what IRC users expect. "Make IRC client look like an IRC client" should have been the top item on Linkinus' TODO list, not an afterthought that users are told to implement by themselves. The idea that the official response on this issue is that we're somehow expecting too much and we should implement our own IRC-like styles for an IRC application is a little depressing. dave on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-267 Thu, 11 Jun 2009 22:52:27 +0000 dave 267@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ i really like the update, long awaited, i didn't even know if there was going to be another one, but thanks for putting in the effort guys. dont fret over the styles guys, people will make tradition/simple styles. i will if no one does >.< @nl <blockquote>Notices are sent to query if "Redirect notices to the consoles" is not checked in the Miscellaneous prefs. So both yout serious dealbreakers are really one-click adjustments to your needs.</blockquote> i think he was talking about how it displayed notices in the current chat window by default before, it does appear like it went back a bit. funny enough this feature was one of the main reasons i stopped using colloquy. Patch on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-266 Thu, 11 Jun 2009 21:18:16 +0000 Patch 266@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ Doesn't help that privilege prefixes are bugged currently, the sub-prefixes (~ for Owner, and & for Protect [q and a]) go away a couple of lines after the person holding them joins the room, so does the name color in the userlist. Lots of flaws with this build, lets hope 2.1 is more useful. Furrikain on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-265 Thu, 11 Jun 2009 19:15:23 +0000 Furrikain 265@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ @nl That's what I did, I enabled both checkboxes and it doesn't seem to work. Any idea on the 2 seperate whois replies? EDIT: restarting Linkinus didn't work, restarting Linkinus & IRC did. Any privileges given before checking the option to display them weren't being picked up. No luck on the whois thing though. nl on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-263 Thu, 11 Jun 2009 18:52:57 +0000 nl 263@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ The checkbox you enabled toggles prefixes in channels. If you want to toggle them in the userlist, toggle "Show privileges as prefixes" in the Userlist prefpane. Furrikain on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-262 Thu, 11 Jun 2009 18:09:27 +0000 Furrikain 262@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ I actually hadn't yet noticed that operator and voice status (@ & +) are no longer being displayed next to the nicknames, am I to understand it is at present impossible to regain this feature? Well, feature, more of a de facto standard in just about every IRC client I've ever used. I tried checking "Prefix users with privileges" but this doesn't seem to affect the userlist? Another weird thing I'm experiencing: when I whois a user, i get 2 whois replies: the normal whois reply notice in channel, but I also get a popup window displaying the exact same information that won't go away until i click "OK", which is rather annoying. ripienaar on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-261 Thu, 11 Jun 2009 17:58:56 +0000 ripienaar 261@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ It's not just about the CSS, not showing age old style information like nick!user@host style information is an epic fail, attempting to add it to a theme seems a nightmare. 1) Copy ~/Library/Application\ Support/Linkinus\ 2/Styles/Whisper\ Dark.lnk2Style/ to Foo.lnk2Style 2) Look in Contents/Resources/js/definitions try to find out where the username is kept, no joy, try to find out where hostname is kept - find USERHOST_KEY = 14; 3) Go to js/controllers/index.js and adjust line 165 to have: type="join">' + messageDetails[NICKNAME_KEY] + '@' + messageDetails[USERHOST_KEY] + ' has joined the channel.</div>' 4) Edit the plist file to change the theme's name to my liking apply, end result? blank space after the @ in the theme. This should surely have worked based on the other uses of messageDetails[USERHOST_KEY] in the js file? Patch on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-260 Thu, 11 Jun 2009 17:52:29 +0000 Patch 260@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ In other words, paying customers must LEARN how to use CSS in order to be able to enjoy IRC the right way because you decided to throw out flashy-'pretty' styles instead of informative useful styles? I know CSS, but not everyone should have to learn it just to get what they want out of the IRC. It's not Cowboy's fault that YOU designed bad styles for the Default set, don't just say 'Oh, he didn't have time to develop a standard IRC layout that everyone uses, so we didn't bother either.. have this flashy one instead". We're not asking specifically for Simplified style, we just want the normal bare-beautiful style that has all the information we need instead of the flashy crap that tells you less of what normal ones do. Pretty silly notion. As another example of extremely useful features that are gone, mouseover-hostname thing is gone.. that was probably the most useful feature, instead of searching alllll through the lists of people you could just mouse over their names and see their hostmask. Maybe it was still style dependent, but it still mattered. Just frustrating when the devs think flashy > informative. Furrikain on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-259 Thu, 11 Jun 2009 17:24:29 +0000 Furrikain 259@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ nl, If you care to explain how i can use a style similar to Simplified with just one click, please feel free to do so. I understand the new update only just came out, but things like a default, simple IRC layout and notices not being treated as queries fall under basic out of the box functionality in my book. Yes, the bells and whistles are nice to have, but I'd much rather be able to start out with a normal layout and i'm obviously not alone in this. I also wasn't planning on "learning about the architecture of creating styles" just to be able to use a style that doesn't look like a coloring book. Anyway, I'm just hoping it won't be too long before this is possible. I suppose some reactions in this thread may have been a bit harsh, but we bought an IRC client that came with this functionity by default, I'm sure you can imagine our surprise after installing the update. nl on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-258 Thu, 11 Jun 2009 17:03:06 +0000 nl 258@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ Simplified is a great style indeed, but it's Cowboy's (Ben Alman) and he's reported not having time to work on it for now. He will port his creation when and if he wants to, not much I can do about this. Woet on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-257 Thu, 11 Jun 2009 17:01:13 +0000 Woet 257@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ I think it's quite obvious that all the people above me want simplified too. nl on "New Styles.." http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/topic/new-styles#post-256 Thu, 11 Jun 2009 16:57:33 +0000 nl 256@http://conceitedsoftware.com/forums/ Woet, no one is telling anyone to do anything. I'm offering a simple solution to *your* problem that most people do not share. Obviously, the concept that your ideas are not shared by everyone else does not come easy to you. You're free to use any other product you like better than ours. Bottom line is, Linkinus came out last evening. I understand that you would have loved a larger range of styles to be available at that time but we're not going to bundle 500 styles hoping that one of them will semi-satisfy Woet. Third-party designers will port their custom styles when they have time to do so. In the meantime, we have worked hard on 6 styles and the large majority of users have found at least one they love so far.